Anglo Fingering Notation

[Michael Reid]

While I have played English concertina for many years, I have recently taken up the 30-button anglo (C/G, as my main interest is Irish tunes). I'm learning mainly from the Niall Vallely CD-ROM, which I like very much. My only disappointment with it is that the sheet-music images don't include any indications of Vallely's choices of buttons and fingering; to get those, you have the watch the video (over and over ....).

 

I'd like to figure out a compact way to annotate tunes that are in standard notation, augmenting them to provide button-choice and fingering hints. In other words, some simple way to indicate that "this e is played on the left," and "this g is the pulled one in the right-hand accidentals row," and perhaps "on this note use the third finger instead of the second."

 

Obviously there are a lot of dimensions -- left or right side, which row, push or pull, which finger -- though in many cases a hint along just one dimension will suffice.

 

Have any of you figured out a good system for this that you'd be willing to share?

[semaj1950]

Hi Michael,

 

I concur. Such a form of notation would be helpful. I amuse myself devising fingerings, but I just might be wasting much time that I could put to better use, and I might be creating pitfalls for my playing down the road. Habits to be unlearned, and the like.

 

Perhaps one with colors and numbers would be good--except for the color challenged among us.

 

Have fun,

 

Jim

[David Barnert]

I'd stay away from colors. If you're designing a system from scratch, take a hint from the abc folks and make it simple to express in ASCII. Better yet, make it an adjunct to standard abc.

[Simon Wells]

I have devised a fairly simple ( though not comprehensive) method. What I do is score a tune ( I use a computer program called Sibelius) and simply add arrows above the staff.

 

I use an UP or DOWN arrow above those notes which have alternate fingerings. UP means you play it on the pull/draw, DOWN means on the push/press. For other notes which don't have alternatives ( e.g. a low E and F#, or high F#) there are no arrows marked ( of course).

 

Ok that only leaves those 4 notes - the G's and A's in the 2 main octaves- for which you have 2 choices ( course we're talking C/G system here). Now since you have in each octave 2 pressed G's and 2 drawn A's to choose I generally don't mark these. Why ? because it's such an individual thing. Some people are G-row based, others are C-row based, others mix em up. So I leave that to the reader's preference.

 

An example of this notation is in the attached document, which has an image of the score of a well-known reel. You can see how it works.

 

Oh of course I should mention that for those rare ( in my case) times when you might play a drawn G or a pushed A on the outside/accidentals row, you would simply mark that with the appropriate arrow.

 

To me it's just so simple, a case of less is more, and so obvious that I'll bet someone has already used it. It's just that you don't see it in the tutors I've seen. I think I've seen em all, including Vallely's, except for Frank Edgely's.

 

You see I've just finished writing a modest tutor on certain aspects of Anglo technique, which I will publish in a few weeks on the net as a free resource. And I came up with this notation in an attempt to teach fingering alternatives. But, as it's only just finished I haven't tried it out on anyone yet, so I'd be interested to hear any comments/critique that anyone may have.

From,

 

Simon Wells

Brenda_Stabbert_s_word_doc.doc

[David Barnert]

I use an UP or DOWN arrow above those notes which have alternate fingerings. UP means you play it on the pull/draw, DOWN means on the push/press. For other notes which don't have alternatives ( e.g. a low E and F#, or high F#) there are no arrows marked ( of course).

This can be expressed in most versions of abc by assigning the graphics of the arrows to text strings. Even easier would be to use the "up bow" (looks like a V) and "down bow" (looks like a 3-sided square, open on the bottom) symbols that the squeezebox world has borrowed fron the string players.

An example of this notation is in the attached document, which has an image of the score of a well-known reel. You can see how it works.

Please don't post complicated Word documents. Not everybody has Word. My Macintosh can translate Word text documents but was baffled by the graphics. For on-screen viewing of graphics, jpg is usually ideal. For high resolution (for printing, eg.) pdf is best, although making one in windows may require the expensive Adobe Acrobat.

[Helen]

Thanks Simon,

 

I've printed it. Now I just have to try playing it!

 

Nice of you to go to so much trouble.

 

Helen

[Michael Reid]

Thank you, Simon, for sharing your approach. I think it's a very useful idea -- I've just been working on your transcription of Brenda Stubbert's to try to get the hang of it -- and I may try to extend it a bit for my own purposes.

 

I look forward to your forthcoming tutor.

 

David, since I have Word on my Mac I was able to open Simon's attachment, and since I have OS X I was able to convert it to PDF, which I've attached.

Brenda_Stabberts.pdf

Edited December 21, 2003 by Michael Reid

[Henk van Aalten]

A little bit late, but I rediscovered this item and wondered if a notation like this is usefull for Anglo players.

 

edited tot add:

• Note that the numbers close to the push/pull line are related to the button-numbers as shown on the top of the image.
  
• The relation between the dots and the tablature is valid for a G/C concertina.
  

Edited November 9, 2004 by Henk van Aalten

[Animaterra]

Henk, it looks as though it should be very readable, but I don't understand the numbers. Are they the button numbers? They can't be the finger numbers, as I don't have six fingers!

[Henk van Aalten]

Henk, it looks as though it should be very readable, but I don't understand the numbers. Are they the button numbers? They can't be the finger numbers, as I don't have six fingers!

The numbers are related to the button-numbers as shown on top of the image.

[geoffwright]

This subject was discussed some 4 years ago and concensus seemed to be that there was no way of notating in a logical way to fit all concertinas above 20 buttons (especially Jeffries which have a number of different layouts).

 

We all thought T(op),M(iddle) and B(ottom) seemed more logical than C,G and Other row, although the larger anglos have extra buttons dotted around, so some variation of <T3 will fit most cases. Of course the 3 stave tab gets around what to call the rows, but can increase the size of the music to "Jumbo print" proportions.

 

We also agreed it was not a good idea to notate whole tunes in tab, but to limit it to where the fingering was different or some cross-rows fingering was required. The tab should only be a reminder, not a notation. It is probably better to learn a few tunes with the new fingering in, to get it into the sub-concious so they become automatic.

 

Various people pointed out that tab of this sort has been used by trad concertina players e.g. Mrs Crotty, and the Helperby Fiddler document was also reputed to have anglo tab scribbled into it.

 

Personally, I only use musica picta for anglo chords or scales (especially in one direction) and use a button layout chart with numbers on.

[Henk van Aalten]

This subject was discussed some 4 years ago and concensus seemed to be that there was no way of notating in a logical way to fit all concertinas above 20 buttons....

.....We all thought T(op),M(iddle) and B(ottom) seemed more logical than C,G and Other row.....

.....We also agreed it was not a good idea to notate whole tunes in tab, but to limit it to where the fingering was different.....

Geoff,

 

Thanks for putting this in a historic perpective. I was not aware of this.

 

I made this sheet (and some more) however for a specific purpose: A friend of mine owns a 20b G/C Anglo and has no idea how to play, nor has he any idea of musical notation.

I discovered that this combination of tablature and musical notation (together with a midi file) helps him to learn the tune. At the same time he is getting some idea of musical notation.

So (within restrictions) this really works!

[JimLucas]

I ... wondered if a notation like this is usefull for Anglo players.

It's one of many simlar notations that different individuals have developed to help themselves and others with the anglo. It's useful, but unfortunately not uniquely useful, which means that it's unlikely that standardization will ever be reached. Other impediments to standarization are 1) how to identify additional buttons (my anglos include ones with 32, 38, 42, and 45 buttons) and 2) what to do about variant placement of notes. Even on a 30-button you get the difference between the Wheatstone and Jeffries standards, and my 30-button Morse has a couple of push F#'s, at my request.

 

Here are some potential variations:

.. Instead of 1, 1', 1'', try using 11, 21, 31.

.. But since that might lead to 20 being in the row with 16, rather than 26, use 10-19 instead of 11-20.

.. For extra notes on either end of a row, you can use letters: 2A, 20, 21, ..., 29, 2X, 2Y.

.. Or instead of 1'-10' or 20-29, try L21-L25 for the left hand and R21-R25 for the right hand.

.. Oh yeah, then there's the left-hand thumb button. May as well just call it T. If there are two together -- I've seen only two instruments like that, -- T1 and T2 seem reasonable.

.. For push and pull, put circles around one or the other set of numbers, or use two different colors.

 

Those are just a few possible variations, not necessarily either better or worse than your own. For myself, I use standard music notation (which I learned long before the concertina), and maybe write in an exceptional fingering here or there, just as some violin and piano scores will do. If it's just a melody, then I normally just use the treble clef, letting my fingers remember which notes are in which hand. For two-handed arrangements I use a double staff similar to a piano score, but instead of treble and bass clefs I have a treble clef and an 8va treble clef. (I work with an old version of Finale, and it lets me cross notes between the staves to indicate which hand is playing the notes, while the stems remain tied to the notes in the staff where the rest of that musical line is found, so I can also see the separation between melody and harmony.) An additional advantage to using standard notation is that I can then vary the fingering and even the pushes and pulls, where there are multiple options.

 

I realize, though, that my method is not the best way to help beginners. For that, Henk, your notation -- or any of various others like it -- should work just fine, as long as those using it understand it and it matches their instruments.

[bill_mchale]

Henk,

What software did you use to do the Tune in? It looked really cool. I am currently looking to do something similar for the button accordion... except based on figers as opposed to buttons.

 

--

Bill

[Henk van Aalten]

Henk,

What software did you use to do the Tune in?  It looked really cool.

Bill,

I did not use any specific software. The basis of the picture is the screendump of a PDF file, obtained by submitting a tune in ABC format to the ABC Convert-A-Matic here on this site. This screendump was opened in PaintShop Pro and the push/pull data were inserted by hand (as wel as the picure on top of the page).

 

I am currently looking to do something similar for the button accordion... except based on figers as opposed to buttons

For button accordeon you should take a look at this site. It is in the French language, but shows a lot of ineresting pages like this one. In fact my example was inspired by this site.

As far as I know they use the program TablEdit. I just had a first glance at the software and it looks promising.

[bill_mchale]

Henk,

Thanks, Not exactly what I am looking for, but I will explore it further. If I wasn't so lazy I would just write the software myself; it can't be that tough .

 

--

Bill

[Muff Worden]

Hi - Just a person who is new to concertinas asking for help in getting started. I am a professional musician who sings and plays other instruments, but this is my first concertina, a newly-arrived Anglo with 20 buttons. I am trying to suss out why they are laid out as they are, and then how to play tunes, but so far have no material at all on paper, just lots of tunes that I can play by ear and many more handy that are on paper.

 

It would probably help me if I could see the button layout on paper, and then also hear from others an idea of how to work out fingering for best use of hands in playing tunes.

 

So if anyone could recommend a logical few steps to follow for a rank beginner on the instrument, that would be a great help. I have ordered a couple of books, but they will take a while to reach me here in the boonies of east Iceland's lovely fjords since they need to come from USA or Europe.

 

Nope - it's not that the postmen/ladies have to slog through deep snow in raging blizzards. Rather, our winters are milder than those in New England and north central USA or Canada, amazingly. It's that the mail is just slow, for whatever reasons, despite plenty of planes coming each day.

 

Thanks very much,

 

Muff in Iceland

[Muff Worden]

Actually, I picked up the concertina and started to check the notes myself, scared the cat out into the kitchen from which she is praying that I don't make that awful ear-splitting noise much longer, and made my own chart of what each button does on the pull or push. It comes out exactly like the two lower rows of the chart Mark Stayton has posted, for C/G concertina with the exception that the leftmost lefthand bottom row button plays D on the pull and low G on the push, while Mark's plays D on the pull and B on the push.

 

So I have a chart handy, and now it's just to get used to the pushing and pulling to make a tune, and to learn how to handle the playing of melody lines so they are fairly smooth. I've heard enough players do that to know it is possible - question is, how long will it take me...??? ;o) I did manage "The Salley Gardens" in halting manner, so guess that is a beginning.

 

Muff in Iceland