38 Button Layout For A G/d

[RobKitt]

I am considering having a 38 button G/D box made and am curious what the collective wisdom of the group is on the best button layout/placement. My thoughts are to simply take the "standard" Jeffries C/G layout as seen on the Suttner website (see link below) and lower each pitch down a fourth (i.e. down two and a half steps). Any thoughts and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

 

http://www.suttnerconcertinas.com/images/k...out_jeff_39.pdf

[Chris Timson]

That layout mostly works quite well, in my opinion. Once change is well worth making if you intend to play English style (melody on the right hand, chords on the left) and that is to make the button next to the G/F# at the top of the middle row on the right hand into a copy of the D/E button on the left hand. This allows you to reduce greatly the number of times you have to take the melody onto the left hand and generally helps keep one sane.

 

Chris

[Jody Kruskal]

Rob and Chris,

 

Here is my Jefferies 38 button layout.

As for

make the button next to the G/F# at the top of the middle row on the right hand into a copy of the D/E button on the left hand.

Chris

I must say that I don’t use that button much. You can see that mine produces the pitches c#/E. The one way I do use it is to play a two note pickup or sort of a slide into push B,d middle row, like this: c#,A# then B,d. This is very effective in blues of rags or old time fiddle tunes because it sounds very fiddle like. If that c# were a D it very well could be more useful though.

 

My chart includes the oct. of the pitches. The convention here is that the lowest note is a ,,G

The C above that is a ,C

The next higher C is a C

The next higher C is a c

The next higher C is a c'

 

I hope you find this useful.

 

Jody

[Chris Timson]

Largely the same as mine, including having C on the "drone" button. This is useful because there is no other C on the push on the left hand, though if you want to have a true drone you could perhaps have it in place of the Bb on the other Bb/B button. One thing I've done with the two neighbouring right hand buttons A#/G# and G#/A# is to swap the reeds so they are now A#/A# and G#/G#. I do find that easier to work with.

 

Chris

[RobKitt]

Regarding the top (or first) button of the right hand G row ... it seems like I would want the additional c# (as Jody's layout has) on the push, to match the c# on the D row, right hand, 2nd button draw. But on the other hand, Chris makes a good point in the need for duplicating the D/E button from the left hand side as this first button. Anybody else want to weigh in. (Decisions ! Decisions !)

 

Also, is the Wheatstone/Lachenal accidental layout for the upper right hand better than the Jeffries if I am going to lean toward the English style of play?

 

Thanks for the wisdom and time.

[Dan Worrall]

Regarding the top (or first) button of the right hand G row ... it seems like I would want the additional c# (as Jody's layout has) on the push, to match the c# on the D row, right hand, 2nd button draw. But on the other hand, Chris makes a good point in the need for duplicating the D/E button from the left hand side as this first button. Anybody else want to weigh in. (Decisions ! Decisions !)

The push c# is indeed handy, but I'd lean toward the duplicated D/E. In essence, the English style of playing converts the anglo into a duet. When a melody drops down into the left hand it is a bit annoying...by upsetting the rhythm of the right hand melody, left hand chords style, it seems to add just one more thing to have to memorize in a tune. When a tune does drop into the left hand, it usually is that D and E. About 10% of Kimber's tunes do that, for example. Keeping the tune all on the right is sheer luxury...unless your brain is better wired for that sort of thing than mine is.

[RobKitt]

That layout mostly works quite well, in my opinion. Once change is well worth making if you intend to play English style (melody on the right hand, chords on the left) and that is to make the button next to the G/F# at the top of the middle row on the right hand into a copy of the D/E button on the left hand. This allows you to reduce greatly the number of times you have to take the melody onto the left hand and generally helps keep one sane.

 

Chris

 

So, can I safely assume that IF I were to stay with a C/G 38 button layout, then this recommended button would be true for a C/G layout as well? Specifically, that I would want a duplicate of the G/A (push/pull) button from the left side on the C row, to also be on the right hand side, C row?

[Chris Timson]

Yep.

 

Chris

[PeterT]

Also, is the Wheatstone/Lachenal accidental layout for the upper right hand better than the Jeffries if I am going to lean toward the English style of play?

 

Hi Rob,

 

If you consider Wheatstone/Lachenal 40/36 key, and Jeffries 39/38 key, as being the closest in terms of capability, I'd make the following comments:

 

I've played Wheatstone C/G 36 key for 24 years, and also had two Wheatstone 40 key instruments for a few years. I have just one tune which I used to play on the 40 key, but can't on the 36 (top note is missing, and I'd have to play it an octave lower). I saw one of my old 40 key instruments today, and it is very happy in its new home.

 

I had a top quality Jeffries C/G 38 key, which I sold because I was only using the part of the keyboard common with the Wheatstone, and I used the Wheatstone for all "complex" tunes. It went to a good home.

 

I've had a B'/F Jeffries for over 10 years, but only seriously played it during the past few months. Apart from a few "odd" note placings, compared with the Wheatstone (which I'm coming to terms with), I have to say that I think that the Jeffries keyboard is the better of the two layouts, and actually gives more scope musically (note: I'm really not musically literate, so hope that this makes sense, or is elaborated upon by other members).

 

So, to sum up, I would recommend the Jeffries layout, although the Wheatstone is perfectly adequate.

 

Regards,

Peter.

[RobKitt]

That layout mostly works quite well, in my opinion. Once change is well worth making if you intend to play English style (melody on the right hand, chords on the left) and that is to make the button next to the G/F# at the top of the middle row on the right hand into a copy of the D/E button on the left hand. This allows you to reduce greatly the number of times you have to take the melody onto the left hand and generally helps keep one sane.

 

Chris

 

So, in keeping with Chris' thoughts above, what is the consensus of the forum in likewise duplicating the A/B button (from the left hand) for the first button on the bottom row (index finger button) right side (next to the d/c# button). Will this likewise reduce the number of times I'll have to take the melody onto the left hand as well?

 

I notice in Jody Kruskal's layout, his choice for this button is A/G (not A/B).

 

Your help is appreciated.

[Jody Kruskal]

what is the consensus of the forum in likewise duplicating the A/B button (from the left hand) for the first button on the bottom row (index finger button) right side (next to the d/c# button). Will this likewise reduce the number of times I'll have to take the melody onto the left hand as well?

 

I notice in Jody Kruskal's layout, his choice for this button is A/G (not A/B).

 

Your help is appreciated.

 

Rob,

 

I don’t know how it would be it that button were A/B instead of A/G but I do use the G draw some and would certainly miss it if it were not there. I make use of both of the pitches in that button in my tune Gone Fishing. You can hear it on my Naked Concertina CD or if you want instant gratification, Theodore Kloba has a link to him playing the tune in the thread titled Recording + Reverb or perhaps you could click here:

http://www.aquila.net/sworkers/rm/gf.mp3

 

BTW, you used the word “choice” in reference to that button. I did not choose those pitches. My Jefferies 38 came that way and the other Jefferies 38s that I’ve examined have all had that button with those pitches. Of course, I haven’t seen as many as Chris.

[Chris Timson]

BTW, you used the word “choice” in reference to that button. I did not choose those pitches. My Jefferies 38 came that way and the other Jefferies 38s that I’ve examined have all had that button with those pitches. Of course, I haven’t seen as many as Chris.

I doubt it. Though I've owned 4 Jeffries G/Ds at different times with a button count ranging from 26 to 45 I have no experience at all with C/G Jeffries for instance.

 

the first button on the bottom row of the right hand of my 38 button also came as A/G. I have only recently started using that button, but I am now finding it jolly useful (I can use it in both directions, for instance, on the tune Waltz Bruno to smooth the rapid reverses). I'd leave it as is. The reason why changing it to A/B wouldn't help is because I don't use the A/B button on the left hand to play melody, because going down the scale of D I switch to the G row and use the B/A button there.

 

More on duplicating the D/E button on a Jeffries. This is perfectly feasible on a 45 button because the reed sizes are about right to swap reeds (and this is how in practice I have been able to try this button out). However on a 38 the reeds are much smaller. The notes on mine are too squeeky to be of much use, but that's no consolation. You could change the A/G, but that button is quite useful as is.

 

After some discussion with the Sage of Heytesbury, Colin reckons that he can make use of some space in the reed pan near the air button to make a new reed chamber (or expand he existing one, I am not clear on this to be honest) that will allow the conversion to be made. My concertina is going in for surgery in the next couple of weeks.

 

Chris